Drain and refill Trans-Hydraulic fluid

Forum Forums Tractor Operation And Maintenance Drain and refill Trans-Hydraulic fluid

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    • #50138
      gabmuks
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        Hello and good day to you all

        I have 254 Chinese tractor similar to Nortrac. I want to drain and refill all Trans-hydraulic fluids. So far I have found and removed 3 drain plugs (not the engine oil drain plug). In total, I have drained out about 5 gallons of old Trans-Hydraulic fluid.

        1) One drain plug directly below transmission.

        2) One large drain plug directly below rear axle.

        3) One drain plug for 3 point hitch lift oil.

        My question is where are the fill points? I know that the Hydraulic lift fill plug is a large tubing on the rear of the tractor and the transmission fill plug is right next to the 4 speed shifter. But how does the rear axle get refilled?

        Thanks for your time.

         

      • #50139
        Piper184
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          The hydraulics uses plain hydraulic fluid, not Trans-Hydraulic

          The transmission and rear differential use 80W-90 gear oil, not Trans-Hydraulic

          Trans-Hydraulic is for use in drive systems that share fluid with the hydraulic system. These transmissions are usually hydrostatic in nature (no clutch or manual shifting). While Trans-Hydraulic might work it is not the best choice and it cost more than necessary for your tractor. I would not use it unless your tractor manual specifically calls for it. Don’t go by the hype on the label of the bucket in the store.

          When you fill the transmission it will get to a point where the oil will flow into the rear diff before the entire system gets “full”. The reason there is a separate drain plug for the rear diff is that it holds fluid that is lower than the flow through point and you can’t get it all out by just draining the transmission.

          The hydraulic tank only holds a couple of gallons after the cylinders and hoses are filled. The trans and diff hold a little more than 5 gallons….I think. I don’t remember for sure and I run mine a little “over full” according to the dipstick. This raises the level so that that upper shafts get more oil and it quiets the gears considerably.

          This is based on some advice I got when the tractor was new and in 17 years I have never had an issue with it. I do periodically drain a little fluid from the bottom of each sump and the front axles just to make sure any water gets removed. Then top off if needed.

        • #50140
          gabmuks
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            The hydraulics uses plain hydraulic fluid, not Trans-Hydraulic The transmission and rear differential use 80W-90 gear oil, not Trans-Hydraulic Trans-Hydraulic is for use in drive systems that share fluid with the hydraulic system. These transmissions are usually hydrostatic in nature (no clutch or manual shifting). While Trans-Hydraulic might work it is not the best choice and it cost more than necessary for your tractor. I would not use it unless your tractor manual specifically calls for it. Don’t go by the hype on the label of the bucket in the store. When you fill the transmission it will get to a point where the oil will flow into the rear diff before the entire system gets “full”. The reason there is a separate drain plug for the rear diff is that it holds fluid that is lower than the flow through point and you can’t get it all out by just draining the transmission. The hydraulic tank only holds a couple of gallons after the cylinders and hoses are filled. The trans and diff hold a little more than 5 gallons….I think. I don’t remember for sure and I run mine a little “over full” according to the dipstick. This raises the level so that that upper shafts get more oil and it quiets the gears considerably. This is based on some advice I got when the tractor was new and in 17 years I have never had an issue with it. I do periodically drain a little fluid from the bottom of each sump and the front axles just to make sure any water gets removed. Then top off if needed.

            Thanks much for reply!!

            Can I ask what kind of tractor you are referring to? Do you have a Nortrac or similar Chinese tractor? The reason I am asking is that you are telling me to use plain hydraulic fluid for the hydraulics. But my manual says to use same oil for the hydraulics, the transmission/rear differential, and the front axle. My manual says use the same type fluid for all of those parts. Will 80W90 gear oil work for my hydraulics? That doesn’t sound like a good idea in this cold climate.

          • #50141
            Piper184
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              I have a 2006 Jinma 284.

              If your manual calls for the Hy-Trans then by all means use it.

              80W-90 will not work in hydraulics, it is gear oil.

              I often move snow well below zero and have problems with even ISO 22 fluid being too thick.

              At -20 with a strong wind the surface area of the cylinders act like big cooling fins and I sometimes have to get out of the wind to let it warm up enough to operate for a little while.

              Is your manual from the manufacturer or from the importer? Jinma made a lot of tractors for a lot of different “Brands”. However, some of those other brands also bought tractors from other manufacturers so it is a little hard to tell who actually made them.

              What make, model and year is yours? I might have a way to look it up.

              Mine came to me in the factory crates. As I assembled it I drained, flushed and replaced all the factory fluids, including the sludge they call fuel.  The front axle was the worst, it had chunks in it that looked like jelly. I flushed that with paint thinner before re-filling. 80W-90 in front axle, trans/diff. ISO 68 in hydraulics, later changed to lighter weights. Clean dyed diesel in the tank and flushed through all the system. New Napa filters on the fuel and engine. Rotella T-4 in the crankcase and governor. Never had a speck of trouble. 950 hours later it still has the original NAPA fuel filter. Oil changed after 10 hours. Other fluids after 50.

              Oil changes now every 100 ish hours and other fluids at 500. Coming up on the big job probably next summer, depending on how rough the winter is.

            • #50142
              DavidPrivett
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                front end 4 wheel drive gears and geared transmissions 75/90 or simular i would not use 140 wt . oil. , If it has a hydro pump here in southern Tn. I use aw -46 in lift systems and if has seperate power steering resivour I use aw-32 . I have found that universal tractor fluid here is to heavy in winter. just based on  my uses. 15/40 in all my  diesel engines.

              • #50143
                gabmuks
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                  I have a 2006 Jinma 284. If your manual calls for the Hy-Trans then by all means use it. 80W-90 will not work in hydraulics, it is gear oil. I often move snow well below zero and have problems with even ISO 22 fluid being too thick. At -20 with a strong wind the surface area of the cylinders act like big cooling fins and I sometimes have to get out of the wind to let it warm up enough to operate for a little while. Is your manual from the manufacturer or from the importer? Jinma made a lot of tractors for a lot of different “Brands”. However, some of those other brands also bought tractors from other manufacturers so it is a little hard to tell who actually made them. What make, model and year is yours? I might have a way to look it up. Mine came to me in the factory crates. As I assembled it I drained, flushed and replaced all the factory fluids, including the sludge they call fuel. The front axle was the worst, it had chunks in it that looked like jelly. I flushed that with paint thinner before re-filling. 80W-90 in front axle, trans/diff. ISO 68 in hydraulics, later changed to lighter weights. Clean dyed diesel in the tank and flushed through all the system. New Napa filters on the fuel and engine. Rotella T-4 in the crankcase and governor. Never had a speck of trouble. 950 hours later it still has the original NAPA fuel filter. Oil changed after 10 hours. Other fluids after 50. Oil changes now every 100 ish hours and other fluids at 500. Coming up on the big job probably next summer, depending on how rough the winter is.

                  Thanks much for reply Piper!!
                  Your knowledge is much appreciated!
                  Mine is 2007 Lu Zhong 254 tractor. I also received mine in crates and had to assemble it. The maintenance manual I have came from the manufacturer.
                  It is a manual 4 speed transmission (with a clutch).
                  Also have a small John Deere 870 with a 3 speed manual transmission (also has a clutch). The JD 870 manual calls for J20D Trans-Hydraulic fluid for everything including hydraulics. The only info I found for J20D oil said that J20D oil is better for colder climates than J20C. So I decided if J20D is good enough for John Deere, it may be good enough for LuZhong. Will see what happens when weather gets below zero here.
                  Both tractors have small 3-cyl diesel engines.
                  For engine oil I’ve been using Rotella 15w-40.
                • #50144
                  gabmuks
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                    front end 4 wheel drive gears and geared transmissions 75/90 or simular i would not use 140 wt . oil. , If it has a hydro pump here in southern Tn. I use aw -46 in lift systems and if has seperate power steering resivour I use aw-32 . I have found that universal tractor fluid here is to heavy in winter. just based on my uses. 15/40 in all my diesel engines.

                    Thanks much for information!

                    I know next to nothing about tractor fluids as you might have noticed.

                    Are you saying that universal tractor fluids are 140W oil? That universal tractor fluids are actually thicker that 80W-90 gear oil?

                  • #50145
                    Piper184
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                      Oils and other fluids can be a big rabbit hole to fall into. Fluid chemistry has evolved a long way since the technology level of our Chinese tractors was drawn on a drafting board!

                      You have SAE and ISO specifications

                      You have manufacturer specifications

                      You have to choose from name brand lubes which are always drastically overpriced and the specs can be hard to find.

                      You have cheap retail store lubes that say they meet or exceed XYZ specs but don’t really give you any information. OR they might say “compatible with…. I find this especially frustrating when you are trying to find the proper fluid.

                      Then you have to wade through old wives tales and urban legends.

                      John Deere want to sell you their fluid. CAT wants to sell you THEIR fluid, etc.

                      They go to great lengths to “educate” their dealerships as to why they need to sell only the approved stuff from them. (I retired from the parts counter and have heard it all)

                      Somewhere in the past an additive was found to be harmful to brass and bronze components. It was taken out and the SAE specs were updated. I don’t think it is much to worry about these days.

                      If I were running a new high tech piece of equipment that cost more than my house, I would definitely stick with OEM products, especially through the warranty period. For older tech stuff like our tractors, I don’t hesitate to use lower priced fluids because they far exceed the requirements of the machine.

                      In your case, I wouldn’t hesitate to use the JD Hy-Trans in your 254. It is more than likely more expensive than the retail versions of 80W-90 and hydraulic, but you don’t have to stock three different items to service your tractors. Makes life easy.

                      And yes, 140 is way heavier than 80W-90. These days it is common to see 75W-90 and 140W called out for automotive differentials and transfer cases. They are usually synthetic or synthetic blends.

                      Back in the 1980’s Chrysler ran Dextron II ATF in some of their lighter weight manual transmissions and 4 wheel drive transfer cases. This made shifting easier cold weather and worked quite well. Although at the time it was more expensive than plain old 80W-90.

                      • #50147
                        gabmuks
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                          Thanks much Piper!!

                          I just now finished putting the 5 gallons of J20D into the Chinese tractor.

                          The manual says to wait 48 hours before checking oil level to make sure oil has settled. I don’t mind waiting.

                          I always have trouble reading that dipstick for the transmission. Do you have that same type dipstick on your Jinma 284?

                      • #50146
                        DavidPrivett
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                          no universal tractor fluid is its own thing, it is designed to be able to operate in hydro and geared appilactions and in the summer it is fine, but in the winter in the hydro systems it is to thick , mostly in power steering systems. most call it just UTF and forget I mentioned anything about 140 wt. oil just do not use it. Unless you have a severely leaking gear box , as a temp. fix only till repair is done.

                          • #50148
                            gabmuks
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                              Thanks for reply.

                              I think I’m just going to try the J20D Trans-Hydraulic oil for now.  The J20D Trans-Hydraulic oil bucket doesn’t say that it is 140W. The description doesn’t mention any viscosity numbers at all.

                              I’ll see how it goes this winter.

                          • #50149
                            DavidPrivett
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                              yes it does it is 20 weight,  I think it is a little light for gears in hot climates but winter coming up so you should be ok for awhile.

                            • #50150
                              gabmuks
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                                yes it does it is 20 weight, I think it is a little light for gears in hot climates but winter coming up so you should be ok for awhile.

                                Cool!!!

                                Now it’s starting to make sense…maybe. I didn’t realize that the J20D was 20W oil. So then the J20C is also 20W I presume. The John Deere manual I have doesn’t mention any oil recommendations for warmer climates though. It simply says J20D.

                                Thanks much for your reply!

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